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[khix]

I have questions that I'm not getting answered anywhere else, so I need to ask:

- What are the CPS laws in TX?
- What are my parental rights in TX?
- CPS says they are required (allowed) by law to interview the child (alone, without parent's knowledge or consent) whom the allegation has been made against.  They say they are then required to meet with every child in the family & the parents, and also required to make a home visit. (b/c a report has been made).  Is this true?  Where can I find the laws?
- All horror stories I've read say that parents should have a lawyer present at the meeting, is this true?  What if you can't afford a lawyer?
- Is it advisable/allowed to tape all conversations & meetings?
- What will CPS think if parents tape the meetings?
- What will CPS say/do at the home meeting?
- What should parents say/do at the home meeting?
- Are all CPS workers liars?  Are all CPS workers out to get the parents?  Is their goal really to take away as many kids as they can?  All the stories/experiences I've read are horrific!  There is not one decent, sane, uneventful story about CPS!  Aren't there at least some decent, sane, caring CPS people?  Are ALL CPS workers to be distrusted?
- If CPS worker says "it's just required by law", if he says "you have nothing to worry about, I did not find anything to be concerned about (with the child was was called in on)", if he says stuff like that, can he be believed?
- How do you get the case closed ASAP?  By cooperating or not cooperating?
- Is it true that they can't enter your home without your consent or search warrant?  If you don't give consent, does that look bad?  Will they then get a warrant?
- What do they look for in your home? 
- If the allegation is completely false, and there is no reason to worry that CPS won't see that, will they then look for other things in the home to get the parents in trouble for?   Or are they only concerned with the specific allegation?
- Does CPS ever investigate the background of those who call in?  Or do they believe everyone, even those who basically are lunatics?

---------------------------------------------

I am horrified & scared......needing prayer for us &  our kids.....especially on MONDAY 4:30 pm central time........please don't preach to me, telling me to trust in God & all that.......I already know all the stuff....I've been praying /reading Bible, and dh & a friend have been telling me the stuff.  The friend means well, but until you have walked in these shoes (the shoes of possibly never seeing your kids again!), you have NO idea what I'm going through, and I WILL fear until the case is closed!  And just because I fear does not mean I am not trusting in God!  You just have no idea what a CPS case does to the mind & heart of a mom until you have been through it! 

I need someone who will listen, understand & allow my fears (not tell me that my fears are unfounded), and I need PRACTICAL help/advice.  Also, the few people I have told have told me that CPS really cares for kids, and that they are just doing their job, and that this will all blow over once they make the visit, but I NEED to know - is that true?  The people who say nice things about CPS have never had CPS called on them!  So, can they really know?  The friend mentioned above says that CPS was called on an alcoholic mother several times, and they made several visits, but they never took her child away....so that is my only hope at the moment.  If an alcoholic can keep her child, then certainly we should have no worries, right?

I NEED to know the TX laws & my rights......my mind/heart is too clouded to do alot of searching/reading right now....I need help.

If I have other questions, I will try to post again later.   PLEASE respond ASAP & please PRAY!!

[andiclare]

Oh khix, I can just feel how scared you are from this post. I'm so sorry you're having to deal with this, whatever exactly is going on.

Here's the official site, but it's geared toward the people who are having to deal with CPS: 

About CPS in Texas

And then here are a couple more sites I found, not government sites:

Fighting Child Protective Services False Accusations

Legal discussion forum about parents' rights re: CPS

Just anecdotally, a friend of mine was investigated by CPS because a neighbor turned them in. And they got in trouble because there wasn't enough food in the house, and a few other reasons. From that experience and another one I was close to when I was a kid, I can say that CPS generally does not show up wanting to take the kids away. That's the last option. They'll usually try to help you first, with whatever the situation is. For instance with my friend I just mentioned, they left her with some food vouchers and told her to call them for more whenever she needed it and they couldn't afford food.

[CKSMOM]

Are you a member of HSLDA?  They can help you address the immediate need even if it is not a homeschooling issue.  You may even want to check their website.  Here are 10 helpful tips that they mention.

THE SOCIAL WORKER AT YOUR DOOR 10 HELPFUL HINTS BY CHRISTOPHER J. KLICKA

1.  Always get the business card of the social worker then your attorney can contact the social worker on your behalf.

2. Find out the allegations.  You generally have the right to know the allegations WITHOUT letting them in your home.

3. NEVER LET THE SOCIAL WORKER IN WITHOUT A WARRANT.  A warrant requires probably cause which does not include an anonymous tip or mere suspicion.  This is guaranteed under the Fourth Amendment of the constitution.

4. NEVER LET THE SOCIAL WORKER TALK TO YOUR CHILDREN ALONE WITHOUT A COURT ORDER. Ona few occasions social worker have been allowed to talk to the children, particularly when severe allegations are involved.  In these instances an attorney chosen by the parent has been present.  As other times HSLDA had children stand by the door and greet the social worker but not be subject to questioning.

5.  Tell the official you will call back after you speak with your attorney.

6.  Ignore intimidations.  Social workers are trained to bluff.  They will routinely threaten to acquire a court order knowing full well that there is no evidence to secure the order.  However is is always important to secure an attorney since there are occasions where social workers are able to obtain a court order with flimsy evidence.

7. Offer to give the officials the following supporting evidence.

 A statement fro your doctor after he as examined your children if the allegations involve some type of physical abuse.

references from individuals who can vouch for your being good parents.

eveidence of the legality of your home school program if homeschooling is an issue.

8. Bring a tape recorded and or witnesses to any subsequent meeting. Often times your attorney can arrange a meeting  and prepare you on what to discuss and what not to discuss.  The discussion at the meeting SHOULD BE LIMITED TO THE SPECIFIC ALLEGATIONS AND YOU SHOULD AVOID TELLING THEM ABOUT PAST EVENTS BEYOND WHAT THEY SHOULD KNOW.  Usually anonymous tips are all they have to go on which is not sufficient to take someone to court.  WHAT YOU GIVE THEM CAN AND WILL BE USED AGAINST YOU.

9,  Inform your church and put the investigation on the prayer chain.

10. Avoid potential situations which could lead to investigation.

Our family will be praying for you....

[ForeverGirl]

Even if you are not a member or HSLDA, give them a call or an email:

Phone: (540) 338-5600 · Fax: (540) 338-2733 · E-mail: info@hslda.org

[SC lady]

Even if you are not a member or HSLDA, give them a call or an email:

Phone: (540) 338-5600 · Fax: (540) 338-2733 · E-mail: info@hslda.org

I've known them offer suggestions over phone for non-members (or non-HS issues) depending on the circumstance. The more you know about where you stand legally, the better, IMO

Praying

[khix]

I have sent HSLDA an email...

Is CPS really as scary as everyone says?

My dh is not worried about them at all.

Dh says that to prove our innocence, we have to be willing to do the home visit.  If we refuse, it will look suspicious, and they will get a court order because they will feel we have something to hide. 

The home/family visit is already scheduled for Monday.  Would it look bad for me to cancel? 

What are my rights??  What is the law??

We just cannot afford a lawyer....the only thing I know to do is video tape the meeting & write down everything.

Does anyone besides andiclaire have experience with CPS, personal or anecdotal? 

If you have been interviewed, how did it go?  What was asked/said?  What did they look at? 

It is sooooooooo nerve-racking knowing someone who thinks they know better how to parent will be coming to your house & scrutinizing everything.  It is making me second guess & question everything in my house.  I am trying to remain calm & just worry about today, but it is so hard.

When I'm nervous, I tend to ramble....and plus, I will feel the need to defend myself, I'm sure, so I'm afraid I'll really be rambling, and will say something that can be used against me.  Pray for my words/mouth!

Also, pray for me to stop crying & fretting, because dh is getting fed up with all the tears and all the "what-ifs". 

Most importantly, pray for my kids!!

God is bigger than CPS, right?

[ladyhen]

Just another resource for information on parental and civil rights;

The Rutherford Institute.

A lawyer friend of ours was affiliated with Rutherford Inst.  for many years.  He gave us the same suggestions listed above for if we ever had to deal with Childrens services. 

[ForeverGirl]

Also, pray for me to stop crying & fretting, because dh is getting fed up with all the tears and all the "what-ifs". 

God is bigger than CPS, right?

Yes. It is best for your children if you will choose to "get hold" of yourself and calm down. Choose to put away your fear instead of being led by it. If your husband is OK with the home visit, let it be. You are choosing all your thoughts and emotions right now. You are choosing fear and anger and distress and suspicion. Choose peace and quietness and patience before God. Ask Him for His help with an attitude of faith. We'll be asking with you.

-gabe

[CKSMOM]

Another thing to consider is that if they really thought there was situation where your children were in danger or whatever, they wouldn't be waiting until Monday to come see you.  They would already be at your door. 

Yes, God is bigger than CPS and He will give you what you need when you need it.  He'll give you what you need for today and He will give you what you need come Monday.  He is faithful.

Still thinking of you and praying....

[denim&lace]

khix.  Breathe.  Really, stop and breathe.  Go for a walk if you can.  Do some stretches on those muscles that I know must be a bunch of thickly tied knots at the moment and really focus on taking deep, deep breaths of air.  I know  you can't really relax, but you must get control of yourself. 

My parents were foster parents when I was in high school and beyond.  In my experience, CPS workers are generally concerned about keeping families together.  I've seen kids go back to families that had no business getting the kids back, because the name of the game was to help families and keep parents with their children whenever possible.  The CPS folks we worked with were just normal people with a job to do, and that was to protect children that were truly in harms way.  They were good and decent people with families of their own.  They had times when their houses got a little dirty, times when they needed to get to the grocery store, times when they lost their patience with their own kids and hollered at them... those weren't things they took children out of their homes for.  They did not want to split families apart unnecessarily.

I believe your husband isn't as concerned about this situation because he knows that you are a good Momma and he knows that his children are well cared for. 

God is bigger than CPS... and very well may be using this situation to the benefit of your family.  I know that sounds insane, but I've seen Him use some pretty strange things to do His work...

My family is praying for yours this weekend. 
~L         

[Monita]

My dh is not worried about them at all.

Dh says that to prove our innocence, we have to be willing to do the home visit.  If we refuse, it will look suspicious, and they will get a court order because they will feel we have something to hide. 

My prayers for you this morning were for your Dh to be resolved and confident in what to do about this and for God to help you to rest in what your Dh chooses.   

I cannot imagine what you are going through but I know it must be so hard for you to be calm, have peace, trust Dh and have faith.  Choose to be strong and full of faith girl....I think your Dh and kids really need to see that....keep reminding yourself  of that, I know it is hard.     This is all for a purpose and God will be glorifies in the end!   

D&L wrote to take a walk, while you are walking think of Noah wife, Sarah,Ruth, Ester, Mary..........see what you can gleen from them.


Will continue in prayer let us know what happens monday.   
 

[Homeschool_Newbie]

Praying for you, KHIX

[seekingtruth]

Praying for peace for you, khix. 

I would try to say as little as possible if you must speak with them.  From what I understand, some workers have been known to twist what it said around- so I would think the less you say, the better.   

[khix]

Thank you for the prayers...keep praying, especially tomorrow at 4:30 pm central.

The allegation is false....it's "nutrition" related, and we know who made the report...a very eccentric (to put it mildly) uncle of mine.  His allegation is completely unfounded, and we know that the evidence will show it.  Please pray that this caseworker will see that, and pray that he is a nice, honest, caring man.

Please, also, still, if you know of anyone with experience with CPS, please share their experience here.  It seems that the only experiences that make it online are negative ones, and surely CPS can't be all bad, right?

[Gabriel Anast]

Please pray that this caseworker will see that, and pray that he is a nice, honest, caring man.

Just as you said, CPS employees are just people like every other government position. We will agree with you in prayer, that your case worker will be an honest, caring, good person.

-gabe

[leighchamberlain]

If you can get in touch with HSLDA, they're a great resource, but you can do this with or without HSLDA. Be honest and be real with CPS. And remember, God is much bigger than CPS.

I work closely with CPS/DCYF as a counselor at a state-run residential facility for severely behaviorally troubled foster kids. First, as stated already, CPS normally tries to keep families together. It's expensive for the state to have kids taken out of their homes, so if at all possible, CPS tries to keep kids in their bio families. Unless the child is in immediate danger of being hurt, your kids will more than likely stay with you tomorrow. I bet you they'll look through your cupboards and if there's food, the kids look nourished, and the house displays a normal amount of cleanliness, you'll be golden.

TALK to the worker and answer his/her questions. Don't feel like you have to overcompensate and try to make yourself sound like someone you're not, but talk to the worker. Be polite, be courteous, and be honest. Believe me, investigative workers are a special breed and never know what they're walking into. They have seen A LOT of bad stuff that's been done to kids. If the kids are safe and happy, the worker is usually happy. Considering they didn't come immediately and investigate, but rather scheduled the investigation AND gave you notice means they aren't too concerned about your kids' immediate safety. If the person who took the call felt like it was REALLY important, CPS would've been at your door - without notice - the day they got the call. From what it sounds like, they're probably just coming out of obligation to cover their butts in case it turned out that your kids were really starving and the media caught wind that someone had called in about it and CPS hadn't responded.  Again, they scheduled this appointment, which means they aren't too concerned.

IF, for some reason, things don't work out in your favor, here's what usually happens:

"There is a seven-step Juvenile Deprived Court Process that DHS and law enforcement officials follow:

1. Emergency Custody Order (An immediate phone call to a judge) — If granted, the child is taken into protective custody. DHS may have already conducted an investigation into the allegations of abuse/neglect or the may begin conducting one at the time the ECO is executed.

2. Show Cause (Emergency Custody) — Hearing within 48 hours or two judicial days of removal. At this hearing, the judge decides whether or not the child is to remain in protective custody. The District Attorney bears the burden or presenting evidence to show that the child would be endangered if returned to the home. If the DA presents sufficient evidence, the children remain in the department’s custody. If not, they are returned to the parental home.

3. Initial Hearing (7 days later) — Parents appear before the judge and they are read their rights. Parents may apply to the court for appointment of counsel (if they are indigent) or if not, will be instructed to retain counsel. The DA must file a petition alleging the child to be deprived within five days of taking custody, but may have up to 15 calendar days if the DA requests it and the court grants it.

4. Pre-Trial — Parents stipulate to charges or the matter is set for adjudicatory hearing.

5. Adjudicatory Hearing — Adjudication is a hearing to determine whether a child is deprived. The state (DA’s Office) must present evidence that proves the allegations in the petition occurred. The hearing must take place within 60 days of the child being taken into custody, although the judge may expand the time limit for good reason. The state presents a petition with the allegations. Parents can agree with the allegations or may request a jury or non-jury trial. The judge decides whether the allegations are true in a non-jury trial. If the child is either enrolled or eligible for membership in a federally recognized Indian tribe, the burden of proof at adjudication is by clear and convincing evidence.

6. Dispositionary Hearing — Held within 40 days of adjudication, this is usually the first time CASA appears in court. If the child was found to be deprived a Dispositionary Hearing must be held to determine whether the child need to be in the parent’s custody, DHS custody or some other placement. If the child is enrolled in or eligible for enrollment in a federally recognized Indian tribe, the parents, the relatives of the child may require placement with relative or within the Indian community. Thirty days before the Dispositionary Hearing an Individualized Service Plan or treatment plan must be filed with the court clerk. Parents receive their treatment plans at the Dispositionary Hearing and will be asked by the judge to vow that they understand the requirements in the plan and sign it.

7. Review Hearings — They occur on the schedule the judge sets them. The law requires review hearings every six months, but most judges review cases every two to three months. In between review hearings, CASA may be asked to attend DHS Permanency Planning meetings, where all parties to the case sit down to discuss options for permanency."

Good luck tomorrow! Let us know how it goes!

[herbalmom]

They aren't required by law to interview the children alone BUT most workers are convinced they are.

I agree with the posters that have said that the fact they didn't get an immediate removal order means that it will probably be OK.

I have helped friends that were really caught up in the system where their kids were removed & the workers were determined to peg them no matter what they did.

I also personally know of several cases where the workers were reasonable, understanding & everything was cleared up w/out problems.

I do know that no matter what, it's VERY scary to be a parent in that situation but you have to keep your composure.

Here's a direct link to the Rutherford Institute's info on Soc Serv:

http://www.rutherford.org/resources/briefs/E09-SSInvestigations.pdf

Praying for you.

HTH Blessings ~herbalmom

[khix]

Again, thank you all for the prayers, and thank you to those who have shared here & via PM some experiences with CPS.

Please keep praying!

[rainygladness]

Been praying since you first posted, khix.

Me, too Khix. 

[JesiRaine]

Praying for you today

[sohnnenstrahl]

Praying for your family and for the cps worker. God can use this to increase His Kingdom, to make more brothers and sisters in Christ.

[ridgerunner]

Will certainly be praying for you. 

Two couple's in my family are foster parents, of the children that have come to them, all have come from severely abusive and/or neglectful homes.  Children who were raped, abandoned, beaten with chains, locked in attics for days, etc.  None of them came in on 'technicalities' or minor concerns.  Not saying that this never happens, just that I personally haven't seen it. 

[Monita]

Will continue to pray for your Dh, you and  social worker.

I do know a man in tx who works for cps.  He is just a man, a dad a totaly normal guy.  He does not agree with all of the things that they have to respond to but as protocol they have to go "check it out".  He has common sense and knows that sometimes people make false claims.  I have been praying for your social worker will have common sense.

[CKSMOM]

Thinking of your family today and praying for you....

[RunAmokFarm]

Praying...

[SimplyTrusting]

Me too. :-)

[denim&lace]

I've thought of you a lot today.  Waiting to hear that everything went well.

[sohnnenstrahl]

Ditto what D&L and Amy3js said!

[khix]

Well, here it is:

The CPS guy seemed nice....but I don't have much faith in that....he could have been faking it.

We videotaped the interview, he had no problems with it.

He said several times that he can clearly see that the allegations are false, and that he's sure he'll have no problem closing out the case.  He said to give him about 3 weeks.  3 weeks....is that a normal amount of time for this to take?

He asked for the names and numbers of 3 friends/family as "collateral".  We complied.  Was this ok to do?

We also signed a medical release for our kids, saying it would be ok if they got our kids' medical records.  Was this ok to do?

These are the allegations:

- that the oldest is "skin & bones"  (which is not true.  She's thin, but she's always been thin, and plus she's grown over 2  inches in the past 10 months!)
- that she appears to be malnourished (again, not true.....all these allegations are coming from a single childless old fat man, who is NOT qualified to be expert on the height, weight, or health issues of children & pre-teens)
- that there are concerns about the kids not getting proper nutrition
- that the parents have financial problems which may be reason for lack of food (which is completely false....my uncle, who made the report, could CLEARLY see all the food we had & had gotten on Thanksgiving.  In fact, we were blessed with so much, that we sent him home with some canned goods, because he was out of work himself!)

(As an aside, we are angry with my uncle for doing this, for causing this!)

The CPS guy also took pictures of my other kids....why did he do this?  We neglected to ask him the reason (we forgot to do/ask alot of things...it's hard to remember when you're in the midst of something).  Was this ok to allow?

The CPS guy did not search our house, did not look at the kids' rooms, did not talk to the kids, and did not look in our kitchen or at our food.  Should we take this as a positive sign?

The CPS guy asked us about 20-30 protocol-type questions, none of which had anything to do with food or nutrition or lack thereof....unless you count the inquiry about our food stamps and other help we have received.   We answered all questions....but in retrospect, maybe we shouldn't have?  Did we mess up?

I asked dh what his gut says, and he says he has peace.  I will try to rest in that, but really, I won't be able to rest until I get that letter in the mail...

Please continue praying...

[rainygladness]

Glad that's over with Khix!  I thought of and prayed for you last night at 5pm est while I was cooking dinner. 
I have no idea about whether the things he did/asked were ok...did you ever get any advice from hslda?
Keep your chin up! 

May the LORD answer you in the day of trouble; may the name of the God of Jacob defend you; May He send you help from the sanctuary, and strengthen you out of Zion.
Psalm 20:1-2

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